The Fox Boss 302 Project Part 1 - Picking a Motor

"K-Roll-PorscheTamer" (k-roll390)
08/29/2014 at 21:15 • Filed to: Fox Boss

Now that I've got a crew to help me out, time to get a motor to build! I've selected a few motors that I could go check out this week and maybe purchase for a complete total overhaul and rebuild. Please take a look at them and tell me which you think is suitable for the future Fox Boss. :)

I'm looking at motors for around $150-200

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There'll probably be more to choose from but this is a pretty good start.

DISCUSSION (91)

 V8 Rustler > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 21:18

This

http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts/part_det…

+ MT82 and call it a day.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > V8 Rustler
08/29/2014 at 21:21

No crate motors.

Aaron James > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 21:31

If your going to do a complete engine build why not go with a 351 windsor?

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Aaron James
08/29/2014 at 21:33

Because I want a 302.

TheD0k_2many toys 2little time > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 21:35

The one from the bronco or the one with 289 heads.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > TheD0k_2many toys 2little time
08/29/2014 at 21:38

What'd you think of #1?

Birddog > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 21:41

What kind of power are you looking for?

#1 seems like a good start. The others seem like a pile of parts some hickerbilly tripped over out back in the shed.

Dsscats > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 21:44

Ah my son. You forget not all 302s are created equal. I'd go for #1 to get the restomod sort of feel. It's the only motor that will actually feel modern in that car and basically the only change you have of getting AC to work without ridiculous work arounds. It's much more compatible with the Fox.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Birddog
08/29/2014 at 21:45

I'm looking for at least 300-350hp. I'm not looking for anything overkill, just something simple that'll be easy to live with and drive. I don't need a drag racer either.

Carbs would be cool too. Especially if it's simpler and cheaper than EFI.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Dsscats
08/29/2014 at 21:46

Yay! Can I carb it?

Aaron James > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 21:47

I put a 5.0 that I built and a manual trans, rearend, suspension, etc into a car that was originally a 4cyl automatic. I built up the engine with roller rockers, trickflow aluminum heads, cam, headers, ported GT40 intake, fat injectors and evenutally nitrous because I couldn't get out of the 13's on engine alone. My only regrets with the car were that I didn't put aftermarket brakes up front and I didn't build a 351 instead of a 302. I had a 5.0 GT as a donor car so it made sense to build the low mileage 302 that was in it. If I did it all over again I would build the 351 from the start, spent the same amount of money and had significantly more power.

TheD0k_2many toys 2little time > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 21:47

Its only a block. Id rather have something more complete. And i like the older engines better.

Vince-The Roadside Mechanic > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 21:49

You know my thoughts.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Aaron James
08/29/2014 at 21:51

Also, 302 is cheaper and easier to find around here than a 351. And if I got a 351, I couldn't call it a Boss 302 anymore.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > TheD0k_2many toys 2little time
08/29/2014 at 21:51

Why do you like older engines better?

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Vince-The Roadside Mechanic
08/29/2014 at 21:52

Indeed I do, but what do you think of the rest?

Vince-The Roadside Mechanic > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 21:54

Risk your life for that one.

Aaron James > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 21:54

Are you starting with a 4cyl car or an 8cyl car?

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Aaron James
08/29/2014 at 21:55

I'm starting with no car and a motor. I wanna build it first then find a car.

tc_corty > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 21:56

Its possible to carb any motor. It's just depends on the money you want to pour into it. You'll also loose a few of the extra fail safes that's come with efi. But its easy to change jets than change injector pulses. Dopends on what you want out of your motor. Cold starts? Drivability? Economy? A carby can be set up to deal with all of these issues but there's a reason injected setups are in every new car.

TheD0k_2many toys 2little time > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 21:58

Less emissions and easier to work on. Also can make good power with relatively small upgrades.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > tc_corty
08/29/2014 at 21:59

I want a jack of all trades carb setup if possible. Cold starts/drivability/economy in one package that can make at least 350hp.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > TheD0k_2many toys 2little time
08/29/2014 at 22:00

I see. I'm kinda leaning towards #1 and 3.

TheD0k_2many toys 2little time > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 22:01

I like 3

Aaron James > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 22:04

Your going to be much better in the long run if you look for a 5.0 car from 86 or newer. The suspension, rear end, and brakes are all much better on a lx 5.0 or a GT. I basically built mine from the ground up using my 4cyl LX and a donor GT that was wrecked. All in including the donor for 500 I spent about 12 grand. If you run into any trouble along the way don't hesitate to contact me I may be able to help. Good luck, great choice too, I love Foxy Stangs.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > TheD0k_2many toys 2little time
08/29/2014 at 22:04

Tell me, how much would you offer #1 and #3 if you were in my position?

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Aaron James
08/29/2014 at 22:06

And this isn't something I expect to be done in a year, this can take a couple years or however long it wants to take, this is just something I've wanted to do for a good while and am now giving in and beginning to spend money on.

TheD0k_2many toys 2little time > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 22:09

If #3 has receipts for the new stuff in the block id probably just give him asking price. Maybe see if he would come down like $20.

For #1 id offer $100 cause it only looks like its the block, pistons, and crank

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > TheD0k_2many toys 2little time
08/29/2014 at 22:14

I'd like to offer $150 and see what he says. It's an hour away too, so I'd like to factor that in as well.

Aaron James > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 22:18

Yes, it does take time, but the first time you fire it up and hear that V8 rumble, it makes it all worth it.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Dsscats
08/29/2014 at 22:20

I'm still stuck. 1 or 3? :(

Both seem to be awesome.

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 22:22

I would go with number one, because if you are gonna build the motor how you want it, buy it bare block.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Aaron James
08/29/2014 at 22:23

What do you think personally, #1 or #3? What do you think are the pros and cons of both?

BrianNutter > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 22:23

5.3 ls will put you far shead.

Dsscats > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 22:24

1. And if you want cold starts and economy, carbs might not be for you :p. There's a much more readily available aftermarket for 1 and it will be much easier to hit 350 with heads/cam/intake and a couple other mods.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies
08/29/2014 at 22:24

And what about my second choice(which is actually #3)? I'm okay with either considering the close prices($150 and $175 or best offer), but am not sure where to go.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > BrianNutter
08/29/2014 at 22:25

Nah. Ima Ford guy; gotta keep it in the family. :)

TheD0k_2many toys 2little time > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 22:25

http://kalamazoo.craigslist.org/pts/4591861887…

This is far away but i wouldnt mind this. I like the purple on it

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Dsscats
08/29/2014 at 22:29

1 is closest and cheapest. I'm really basing this off of whether or not EFI is cheaper in the long term, because it just sounds super complex and carbs are a proven technology. Lets put it this way, if the Fox Boss had to be a backup car at somepoint, which fuel system would you take?

and could #3 be made to EFI?

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > TheD0k_2many toys 2little time
08/29/2014 at 22:29

3 hours away and $200+ over budget. :(

TheD0k_2many toys 2little time > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 22:34

Yea close to me though lol

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > TheD0k_2many toys 2little time
08/29/2014 at 22:36

Booo! ;P

Aaron James > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 22:37

Hard to say there are some early 302 blocks that were stronger due to the alloy used but other than that I think they are all the same. Here are a couple articles that may be of interest. One explains the different blocks and the other is a 400 HP budget build.

http://www.mre-books.com/interchange/in…

http://www.mustangandfords.com/how-to/engine/…

TheD0k_2many toys 2little time > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 22:37

I wish i had a use for it. But i have too many things now anyway

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > TheD0k_2many toys 2little time
08/29/2014 at 22:39

What have ya got? :P

TheD0k_2many toys 2little time > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 22:42

Miata, new to me f150, project offroad beater jeep, winter beater escort, late 80's suzuki two stroke dirt bike, not running yamaha blaster, full time job, and next week two college classes

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Aaron James
08/29/2014 at 22:45

It says to find a 1967-early 70s block. I guess that means the '95 isn't better? What should I do? I was about to consider dropping the '95 motor an email.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > TheD0k_2many toys 2little time
08/29/2014 at 22:46

Damn..

tc_corty > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 22:48

Efi isn't all that complicated, once you've wrap your head around it, it becomes really obvious. When you boil it down, instead of vacuum dictating the amount of fuel (carb) you've got a computer taking in info from temp sensors, Afr, map or maf, tps etc to decide how much fuel its gonna need (efi). With the size of the aftermarket and the prices in the states, I'd go with efi. You can buy self learning systems that basically tune themselves when you drive. But in saying that all my motors have been carbed and the majority of my mates motors are carbed. If it comes with efi we use it. If not its too expensive for us to change to it, regardless of the benefits and power that come with it. Its really up to you, search for articles on carb vs efi there'll be plenty of them to give you the insight to make an informed decision. And don't worry if the article isn't exactly for your motor, the ideas and arguments are fairly universal.

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 22:49

I think the aftermarket and from a reliability standpoint I would go with the '95. On top of that, if you want that fox to handle, you'll want less weight over the front which can be accomplished with aluminum heads.

Aaron James > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 22:54

The thing is if you are looking for around 300-350 HP it really doesn't matter. I doubt the other engine is the slightly better block. I'd probably go with the 95 also. Have you checked the mustang forums for suggestions?

http://www.stangnet.com/mustang-forums…

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Aaron James
08/29/2014 at 23:01

I made an account at Mustang Forums.

http://mustangforums.com/forum/classic-…

So many Mustang forums and I'm not sure which is best.

TheD0k_2many toys 2little time > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 23:07

Yea little over my head. Also i am a chronic procrastinator

Dsscats > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 23:17

There's a reason why modern cars switched to FI. I'd go with that if it had a chance at being a daily

Dsscats > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 23:17

And what's going on with your dad?

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies
08/29/2014 at 23:19

Then that's what I'll do then, thanks!

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > tc_corty
08/29/2014 at 23:20

Will do, I guess I'll go with the '95 block and move on from there.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > TheD0k_2many toys 2little time
08/29/2014 at 23:20

You and me both friend.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Dsscats
08/29/2014 at 23:20

What do you mean?

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Dsscats
08/29/2014 at 23:21

Fair enough.

TheD0k_2many toys 2little time > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 23:22

Damn engineering brain.... too many ideas up there all the time

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > TheD0k_2many toys 2little time
08/29/2014 at 23:24

You're in engineering too? :O

TheD0k_2many toys 2little time > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 23:25

Yup. Two years at community college right now. Getting stuff out of the way until i transfer to WMU

Aaron James > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 23:26

I'm not either. There wasn't much around back in the late 90's when I built mine. Just look at post counts and members, or ask on both.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > TheD0k_2many toys 2little time
08/29/2014 at 23:28

Nice. I'm over at LTU on the east side of the state(I'm in Southfield). There are some Oppos over there with a car club at WMU.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Aaron James
08/29/2014 at 23:29

Will do.

TheD0k_2many toys 2little time > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 23:29

Yea i go to a meet on WMU engineering campus every sunday night.

Aaron James > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 23:31

looks like higher post count on the one you signed up at. Both started in 2003 so more traffic on mustangforums

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Aaron James
08/29/2014 at 23:35

Awesome, hopefully I'll get some responses soon. I'm itching to get one of those motors!

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > TheD0k_2many toys 2little time
08/29/2014 at 23:36

I'll have to venture over there one weekend.

TheD0k_2many toys 2little time > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 23:38

Oh yea man. Everyone is welcome

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > TheD0k_2many toys 2little time
08/29/2014 at 23:42

Maybe I'll head over on one of those weekends I head over to MSU. I'll be much closer and it'll be worth it for sure.

TheD0k_2many toys 2little time > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/29/2014 at 23:48

Yea MSU isnt too far compared to Detroit

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Dsscats
08/30/2014 at 00:18

I mean, he's fine.

Dsscats > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/30/2014 at 00:20

I just misinterpreted a comment

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Dsscats
08/30/2014 at 00:25

Oh, Vince's comment. No worries, he's in good health. :)

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/30/2014 at 02:23

This is not a "Take a dump on K-roll post", just an FYI before you read the first line.

Re-read your old posts about trying to buy a 944 and then compare it to your plan that is still coming together to do this mustang swap. Notice the difference a few months and some critical thinking can do for you? It's a pretty solid long-term project and far from impossible, even with your own limited skills, experience, and equipment. Parts are everywhere along with knowledge and people to back you up. In every car-guy circle, there is at least one person with experience in building up a fox mustang with a 5.0. And you want to do this in stages over a few years and start by sourcing your ideal motor as that seems to be both cheap and portable. Having never built a car up to that extent, I don't know if that is the 100% right call, but there is logic to it. You can pick up a block and some upgraded internals for less than a grand.

This project stands a pretty good chance of success. And I have never seen a "Boss fox" before. There was the 90s Boss though. That thing was kinda cool.

Kinja'd!!!

ChainheartMachine > Aaron James
08/30/2014 at 03:29

I find it hard to believe you couldn't break 13's on motor. Unless you have mismatching parts and flow. I've seen guys in base LX's with GT40 heads and a nice ported intake do 11's on slicks. I would suggest the same to the OP, many of the matched parts GT40 cars make around 340-350 HP at the crank.

ChainheartMachine > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/30/2014 at 03:31

good on you son, stay away from that Chevy crap.. Only complicates things in a fox

ChainheartMachine > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/30/2014 at 03:39

Sounds like a fun project. I've done three 5.0s myself, all for varying degrees of performance. If I were you, Ide stick with an EFI setup (better for cold starts, mpg, and tuning if you plan on that). A nice edelbrock or trick flow top end kit will get you in the 345 HP range. If you want to go the budget route, find an Explorer intake and heads, and a Cobra/Thunderbird cam, full bolt ons and exhaust, and get the guy Tmoss to port match everything for you. If you don't need emissions, get a custom Comp cam.

Philbert/Phartnagle > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/30/2014 at 06:07

Go with #1 IMO. A roller cam engine block will save you the expense of converting an older one, it will run smoother and make more power easier.

BrianNutter > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/30/2014 at 09:31

347's are always cool. Let me know if you ever need a rotating assemby. Is it the 99 explorers that came with gt40 heads?

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > BrianNutter
08/30/2014 at 10:27

It was some year that Explorer 5.0s had GT40 heads, but I'd love to have some GT40s. My friend is going to a local junkyard to see what we can find and use. What are rotating assemblies for? :)

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Philbert/Phartnagle
08/30/2014 at 10:33

And it'll be easier to do an EFI build as well?

ChainheartMachine > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/30/2014 at 13:43

1996-1998 have the standard GT40s, 1999-2001 have the GT40P's. Both are good, the later models have a slightly higher static compression, good for around 15 HP.

Philbert/Phartnagle > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/30/2014 at 14:39

I don't know about "easier", that I suppose depends upon how well acquainted with carbs and the tuning of them you are, but it will be a smoother running and starting engine. If you car already has EFI like mine did, you just need to convert it to the 89 MAF system for the best adaptive tuning for the older EFI systems IMO. Personally I much prefer the EFI over carbs and at first I was one of those who fought against the EFI when it first came out.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Philbert/Phartnagle
08/30/2014 at 14:52

I've never done anything like this before; I'm new to both. Whichever one can be used all year round more efficiently is the one I'll go with.

Philbert/Phartnagle > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/30/2014 at 15:11

Go with the EFI in that case. You won't be sorry when it is cold out and you can start your engine and it will set there and purr like a kitten instead of coughing, gagging and gargling itself to death.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Philbert/Phartnagle
08/30/2014 at 15:16

Okay. I need to list out the parts I need to make this work. Wanna help?

BrianNutter > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/30/2014 at 21:49

crank rods and pistons. Strokers usually and 030 overbore. 3.4 stroke equals 347ci

tc_corty > K-Roll-PorscheTamer
08/31/2014 at 02:13

I was thinking about this thread last night. If you're wanting to go with carbs cause they look cool and the added wank factor that comes with them but want to economy, drivability etc of efi, you should go for something like a quad stack injection. The look with give you a horn and the induction sound will finish you off. Haha